Systems of Harm
Design systems are the systems of tools, processes and practices that we use to create digital products, like websites and applications. But can design systems play a role in perpetuating systemic harm? Can they do anything to mitigate it?
About the show
Design systems are the systems of tools, processes and practices that we use to create digital products, like websites and applications. But can design systems play a role in perpetuating systemic harm? Can they do anything to mitigate it?
In this series, design systems consultant and podcast host Amy Hupe interviews guests about their experiences of design systems, systemic exclusion, and how we can work to design more inclusive experiences.
Episodes
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Design systems and activism with Geri Reid
October 2nd, 2025 | Season 2 | 53 mins 9 secs
amy hupe, systems of harm
What does effective activism look like when it comes to design systems and inclusion? Why are so many of us missing the mark when making the case for prioritising accessibility, and what can we do about it? I talk to Geri Reid, accessibility specialist, to get her tricks of the trade.
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Applying systems thinking to our design with Sheryl Cababa
June 20th, 2023 | 54 mins 16 secs
sheryl cababa, systems of harm
To round off the series, I’m speaking to Sheryl Cababa, Chief Design Officer at Substantial, lecturer, and author of her, Closing the Loop: Systems thinking for designers.
In the episode, Sheryl and I talk about how our design work fits into the wider societal, economic and political systems around us and she shares tools and frameworks for making the invisible, visible.
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Design systems and racism with Imran Afzal
June 13th, 2023 | 46 mins 49 secs
systems of harm
Imran Afzal is a Principal Designer working on the design systems team at Co-op digital. He’s written and spoken prolifically about his work on design systems, and his own experiences of racism and discrimination.
In today’s episode, we explore the ways in which design systems can perpetuate or mitigate racism in our digital products and practices.
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Design systems and accessibility with Fred Warburton
June 5th, 2023 | 52 mins 11 secs
amy hupe, fred warburton, systems of harm
How can design systems help us to create more accessible digital products and services, and what are the limits to that? In this episode I talk to design systems manager, accessibility advocate, and good friend of mine, Fred Warburton.
Fred shares his experience with sight loss, and how that motivated him to learn about digital accessibility, and create meaningful change.
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Design systems and dyscalculia with Laura Parker
May 30th, 2023 | 47 mins 56 secs
laura parker, systems of harm
Dyscalculia is a learning difference characterised by a persistent difficulty in understanding numbers. In this episode, Laura and I discuss her experiences with dyscalculia, and how design systems can help to create more inclusive digital products for people like her.
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Design systems and trans exclusion with Luke Murphy
May 22nd, 2023 | 54 mins 2 secs
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How do design systems contribute to trans-exclusion in our digital, social and political systems? What can we do to create more trans-exclusive experiences? In this episode, I talk to Luke Murphy, a design advocate and a good friend of mine who identifies as non-binary, to explore this issue.
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Design systems and cognitive bias with David Dylan Thomas
May 10th, 2023 | 49 mins 59 secs
david dylan thomas, systems of harm
How does cognitive bias affect the way we design and make digital products, and the way people experience them?